Yep, Seb summed up my position nicely as well.  It's going to take a lot
of different kinds of efforts to grow Zope.  The next round of adopters
might not look like the rest of us, nor be motivated in the same way.  A
professional, for-fee guide and magazine might be just the ticket for
them.

I personally appreciate the variety of things that Mark is doing.  And
if the primary beneficiary of this is Beehive, it's ok by me.  That kind
of goal alignment is good.  As Mark noted, he forked out some pretty
serious bucks both last year and this year to send a ZC person to his
BBQ.  Kudos, Mark.

There's another point as well.  For those of you that think this should
be done as part of the community and for free...well, I don't see much
activity in our rejuvenated effort to get a new zope.org going.  There's
around four of us doing most of the work on the zope-web mailing list. 
We occassionally put out calls for participation, but it's still the
four of us.

We're entering a critical time.  Something will happen in the next few
weeks.  If you *really* think that the community can also perform on
non-programming tasks, here's your chance to prove it.

Come join the zope-web mailing list.  I'm working this thing full time
right now and I can *definately* keep you busy.  But please, you have to
bring time as well as opinions.

--Paul

On Thu, 2002-04-18 at 11:32, seb bacon wrote:
>  Couldn't resist a throwing in some comments.
>  
>  I don't see how it's parasitic of Beehive to write a 'closed-source'
>  magazine.  Is it parasitic of me to charge clients for software I've
>  developed on top of Zope?
>  
>  Beehive do lots of good stuff, and even if they didn't, I wouldn't mind
>  them doing this.
>  
>  What I do think is worth dwelling on is....:
>  
>  The community is made up of a ragged collection of enthusiasts, geeks,
>  maverick members of IT departments, academics, small businesses and a
>  benevolent dictatorship.  How can we best work together towards a common
>  good is something that interests me greatly.  Those of us who depend on
>  Zope to a massive extent for our livelihod have to create viable
>  business models, but this does not have to create a conflict with the
>  people who are less engaged with the business aspects, for whatever
>  reason.
>  
>  I'm sure there are some really interesting, novel approaches to this
>  problem, just waiting to be discovered.
>  
>  seb
>  
>  
>  <snip lots of opinions from various people>
>  
>  
>  
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